jcox07 wrote:All I am saying is if scca is making a road tire front wheel drive and a road tire rear wheel drive and a road tire awd what is the difference between those classes and other classes.
that's just it... they are effectively doing away with those classes with the new rule sets. For now it sounds like more classes but in the long run it sounds like there will be fewer once they re-evaluate the 'street' classes and make adjustments based on performances.
I totally agree... I like the RT classes as they sit now. If they left that be, and did away with the rest of Stock ( excluding the high HP cars ) and made SMA,SMF,SMR and so on there would possibly be less classes or at least the same amount and there'd be more 'parity' for cars.
That starts to get to the point where there's too much compromise to the masses though. No one is being forced to run any class, but I also don't think anyone should get the shaft based on their choice either.
Brian Huber
2021 Stingray Coupe ( NOT for cone hitting )
2016 Scion FR-ETH 58/158 SSC
Scalded Snail Racing
I agree Brian but at the June Blytheville event last year an evo ran in asp and with a different driver in sm, this is where my problem lies. Class the cars and they run in that class, bumping to a class where you think you can win/tire I do not agree with.
JY ( Jeff ) Cox
ETR R.E
2018-2021, 2022, 2023 Solo Nationals Co Chairman
2010 GT500
The thing about SM is that there are only a handful of good cars in the country. Good street prepared cars are often good enough to win SM at national events.
oh yeah... I think that's complete BS. I know that was rampant in ST for a while... the same car ran in 2 different classes.
I don't agree with that at all. That being said, if the car is under prepped for a class and runs in it, should that person be chastised for doing well in it?
ASP car fully prepped going into SM and cleaning house... is it the car, the driver, or the class not having a car that is prepped well enough?
or none of that?
I know a guy that was in SS and because he wanted a tropy in Dixie he figured he'd run in SP since he felt the class was not strong.
I don't agree with that either. People picking a class that they can win in regardless of how preppred the car is for that class.
Now, if someone's car broke and they got offered the ride at the last minute.... that MIGHT be a different story.
Brian Huber
2021 Stingray Coupe ( NOT for cone hitting )
2016 Scion FR-ETH 58/158 SSC
Scalded Snail Racing
It is a class legal, underprepped car. It is your job to beat it.
The STC/STX Civic thing was nice because it let people defer expenses and bring their friends to nats. I ran as an STXtra at nats twice when I probably would have stayed at home if friends didn't help me out.
It is a class legal, underprepped car. It is your job to beat it.
The STC/STX Civic thing was nice because it let people defer expenses and bring their friends to nats. I ran as an STXtra at nats twice when I probably would have stayed at home if friends didn't help me out.
I see the point there as well. Like I said, a person can't be punished for his car not being as prepped as the rest of the class and still win. Like you said, if you don't like it... beat the person ( in competition, not with a bat ).
Your reason is a good one, to get participation and get to go to nationals. Someone doing it because they know that wouldn't 'win' in a class and move to another is an entirely different story.
Brian Huber
2021 Stingray Coupe ( NOT for cone hitting )
2016 Scion FR-ETH 58/158 SSC
Scalded Snail Racing
He's the only guy I personally know that has done it, and I always make it a point to comment about it. If Robert had driven both days @ that event, the guy would've missed a trophy spot but he only drove Saturday.
BTW... one of these days @ an event I'll actually have to figure out who you are.
Brian Huber
2021 Stingray Coupe ( NOT for cone hitting )
2016 Scion FR-ETH 58/158 SSC
Scalded Snail Racing
steverife wrote:
You Hoosier folks are the ones that get crazy about trying to win tires.
Oh most definitely, because nobody who ever ran on Yokahama, BFG, Kumho, Toyo, whatever tire company or car company, or whoever was giving contingency at the time EVER got crazy trying to win.
steverife wrote:
You Hoosier folks are the ones that get crazy about trying to win tires.
Oh most definitely, because nobody who ever ran on Yokahama, BFG, Kumho, Toyo, whatever tire company or car company, or whoever was giving contingency at the time EVER got crazy trying to win.
I see ya trollin,
Back to the real subject of this thread... STREET TIRES SUCK!
Now, back to your regularly scheduled bitching.
Mark Pilson
03 Z06 - Sword
09 Mustang - Club
01 Excursion - The safe you dropped from the 10th story
I've ran both categories, Ted. This is a lot more common in the race tire classes because 1) they have more classes to jump into, and 2) they get more contigency. If you jumped to STX in your ST Civic on Hankooks on the front and Toyos on the rear 3 years ago and won a tour, you didn't get anything but a trophy.
No camber adjustments are available for my car unless I get some custom made ie: really expensive rally plates custom made because the parts just do not exist in the US.. Even them the car is so outclassed with the newer cars coming out it is not even funny. At least when I was running the Hoosiers a couple of years ago, I was able to place relatively well, now not so much. The only advantage I see is I now have an excuse to not change tires...............
MARKP wrote:
thrdeye wrote:
Another thought on the camber allowance is that I'm hopeful that it would allow "also-rans" to actually be in the noise of competition.
However, this isn't really the case. Cars are typically classed on performance potential. If a car can get camber, it has more performance potential than one that can't. Therefore, you have offsetting factors. My 140hp Celica can get camber. The 240hp Neon can't. Give them camber and it starts looking more like a DS car.
Here is a better example of car classing, in the blytheville pro they did a bump class and in that class was sm/esp/dsp/csp/ssp/asp with several national champions such as Mark Madarash esp and Andy Hohl ssp and Joe Tharpe ssp. I think we can all agree that they are BIG TIME drivers and you can look at the results Mark finished 4th Andy 6th and Joe 9th. First and second to a asp fully prepped evo and different evos by the way Aaron Miller won and Jon Wagner got second. I don't think they are any better driver than a 8 or 9 time champion like Mark or how ever many championships that Andy and Joe have, it is that an awd that is reasonable prepped in my opinion has an advantage and that should be addressed by the scca leaders. I think the field should be a level field and an awd car that has been prepped is going to usually win, as they did in the blytheville pro.
JY ( Jeff ) Cox
ETR R.E
2018-2021, 2022, 2023 Solo Nationals Co Chairman
2010 GT500
