Concidering building car for class

CMS-GT4 · Post by **CMS-GT4** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 2:49 pm

I am concidering building my alltrac to fit in a specific class. I have to decide how and what I can do before buying my engine and what not.

I was shooting for a street touring class. One idea I had to stay in that class is to purchase a front clip from a higher model of my car. The higher version of my car was called the gtfour rc, and had a differnet hood and bumper as far as cosmetic goes, and it has a different engine, transmission and rear diff.

With the parts from a clip purchase I can change everything on my car to be equal to what is called the gtfour RC.

I already have the hood and gearbox. All I have to change out to match is the engine which uses a wta intercooler, and has 235 hp/tq rather then 200.

If I was to use these parts and stay with mods as listed in the rule book, would this keep the car in a st class?

Here are the other mods.
Sway bars, bushings, coilovers, strut bars and full exhaust. Also some 17x9" wheels with 245 wide tires. Slotted rotors and supgraded pads/ and lines.

Is there anything on that list that might kick me out of sts, and is there any sugested mods to add to that, allowed in that class.

thanks,
JC

Post by **thrdeye** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 3:27 pm

SM for you.

Reasons Street Touring won't work......

The wheels are too big. 8 in wide is the maximum wheels width. You can't swap engines in STS/X. I'm sure your displacement and turbo would kick you out of STS. STX is possible if you put the stock body panels back on the car and don't up the boost any, but the gearbox would also have to stay stock in STX, I do believe. If the exhaust is catless, then you're out of STX.

Was that engine/car even released in the US? Changing every little detail to coincide with an upgraded model is only for stock class. Such as if you wanted to upgrade a touring 350Z to a track model Z. Everything that was or was not on the track model would have to be correct.

Don't be afraid of SM.....it isn't that bad.

CMS-GT4 · Post by **CMS-GT4** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:09 pm

I like SM for local, but if I am going to be serious, I am afraid my budget may not hold up against SM cars if I decide to try and push it further out. If I go as far as staying in SM, I think I may shoot for 400 awhp instead of the 300 I was shooting for in the past.

I can settle on 16x8 wheels. The car was offered in about every other country but america. Its even in canada. The engine is basicly the same, it just has a different intercooler, ECU, and cermaic turbo instead of steel. The rear lsd is the same as offered as an option for my car. It was standard though, plus mine does not have one.

The gearbox is mostly the same, the 1st and second gears are lower, and the final drive is higher. Everything else is the same.

Just trying to get a feel of what I want ot do with the car.

MARKP · Post by **MARKP** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:13 pm

FYI, you also can't use JDM parts in SM unless they are allowed elsewhere. For example, you couldn't use a JDM turbo but since any turbo is allowed in SM, you can use it.

Typically where you could run into a problem is with things like structural items, dashboard swaps, and maybe with engine blocks, etc.

This is good advice for anyone building a car specifically for a class, BUY A RULEBOOK!! I don't say this because I don't like answering questions but because the $15 investment and a few hours of your time reading and re-reading the rules will save you many hours and possibly thousands of dollars fixing things that you didn't know about and we forgot about.

I bought the rulebook before even buying my car and still had to fix things that I misinterpreted in the rulebook. I hate to think of where I would have ended up if I didn't even read the rules.

CMS-GT4 · Post by **CMS-GT4** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:22 pm

Is the rule book online not up to par? That is the one I have been reading, but some things are unclear or left unsaid.

Post by **thrdeye** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:27 pm

The damn rules just need to be simpler is all it is. Curt was telling me about a "points system that NASA uses which makes tons more sense. Like he said the rules, as they are currently, scare off a lot of younger people b/c they have to compete in SM or higher for doing simple mods.

I am probably not even legal for SM and I get romped, hell I don't know. My STi intercooler is japanese and I have an intercooler spray system.

BTW, only air-to air intercoolers are allowed in SM.

scottgib · Post by **scottgib** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 5:31 pm

Well that car could sure be competitive in STS, (like wipe them out) and certainly competitive in STX, but ................

If you turned the car into an exact duplicate of the later version, the wheels and tires are way too wide for STS and the wheels are 1" too wide for STX. If the model you are converting to was not offered in the US it is a no go in stock, sts, or stx.

Here is a link to the rule book: http://www.scca.com/_filelibrary/File/2005SoloRules.pdf It is up to date, but you have to read a lot to find everything applicable. For STS and STX, you also have to read the Stock rules.

JDM-spec cars are excluded from SM class.

I believe that JDM engines are routinely put into SM cars however.

You have some reading to do before sorting this all out.

steverife · Post by **steverife** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 8:54 pm

I think you already own "the car to have" in B stock. If that is your objective, why even mess with the Celica?

Post by **thrdeye** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 9:01 pm

not cbring wrote:I think you already own "the car to have" in B stock. If that is your objective, why even mess with the Celica?

2nd! Now that the S2K is in AS, there is really nothing in B Stock that can hang with the 350Z. I would buy a set of 275 V710s ( the only @#(&*#%^ size that is in stock) and slap em on the Z and go kick some ass.

MARKP · Post by **MARKP** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 9:05 pm

I really don't think the rules are all that complicated. SM happens to have what is probably the most complicated ruleset but I still don't think it's that bad. What you have to do is understand the classes that are the foundation for SM. This means that you have to read and understand the rules for stock, ST and SP.

All this made me go read the SM rules. It appears that JDM engines would be allowed per section 16.1.D.1. BTW, Chris, it looks like your intercooler is no problem per section 16.1.D and it wouldn't be a problem to use an air to water intercooler either. However, you can't use your handy intercooler sprayer during competition due to section 15.10.C.

See, all clear as mud!

Mark McCrary · Post by **Mark McCrary** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 9:17 pm

I agree with the others. If you are wanting to get "serious" use the money that you were going to spend on the Celica and buy some shocks for the Z. I will be cheaper in the long run it you compare it to a SM car. You could spend $20,000 in SM with the car and not run with the top guys with it. Just my opinion but if it was me and I wanted to be competitive I would be working on the Z car.
Best of luck,

Post by **thrdeye** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 7:56 am

MARKP wrote:However, you can't use your handy intercooler sprayer during competition due to section 15.10.C.

See, all clear as mud!

Yep, but that still doesn't make sense. The spray setup is STOCK on the STi and the EVO. There is no way to poilice its use (especially the EVO one as it is automatic and you can set it to come on at different times)

Oh well, back to the handheld sprayer for the SeDiv

steverife · Post by **steverife** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 8:03 am

Personally, I've grown accustomed to the SCCA system and think the NASA points system would be a NIGHTMARE as far as getting cars classed correctly.

thrdeye wrote:Oh well, back to the handheld sprayer for the SeDiv

I think that is what he was talking about.

CMS-GT4 · Post by **CMS-GT4** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 8:43 am

I plan on running the Z at some upcoming events. I just am unsure if I will keep the Z, if I end up single again. I am mostly weighing out my options. Maybe once I get a chance to get the Z on the course, I may never want to go back to the celica.

Thanks for the imput.

MARKP · Post by **MARKP** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 9:05 am

thrdeye wrote:Yep, but that still doesn't make sense. The spray setup is STOCK on the STi and the EVO. There is no way to poilice its use (especially the EVO one as it is automatic and you can set it to come on at different times)

I think the line of thinking on this subject is they don't want water ending up on the course or start line due to an on-car system. Just a little water on course for a car with slicks is a problem. Obvously, they can't tell you to take somehing off that came on a stock car, so the STI's and EVOs have a slight edge there. However, you could do things to make up for the possiblity that the STI or EVO driver can spray the intercooler while on course, since you are in SM.