Smack Talk 2015

[rocket71]

I have raced on both street and race tires. Due to a great codriver and a lucky win by me, I never had too buy a new set of Hoosiers. It still stressed me having to track the number of runs on each set. Ensuring we had stickers when we had to go head to head with Tharpe. Ugh...we could win on Kooks that were ran to the tread bars.

[jcox07]

Which car you driving on kooks Berry?

[steverife]

I ran both streets and race tires. I loved the old stock and think a lot that happened over the last few years to get us to street was disingenuous, but street tires are going to be cheaper and easier for most people. It opens up a lot of car choice options for me that I never would have considered due to the cost and transportation of race tires.

[thrdeye]

If you go off of Pauls new vette that he got and adessa was his first event with 300 tw michelin on his vette and he lost 4/32 of tread just at adessa in one event and yea I know he ran about 20 runs or so, that would be probably 3-4 local events with that many runs. Now add 3-5 national tours and 7-8 more locals and daily driving as well, one would be lucky to get by with only 2 sets, but more than likely he would need 3 sets of tires. Three sets of Michelin 315 tires at 542.00 each comes to 6504.00 plus tax. If you have a little car that is light and your tire size is a 15 inch in a 225 or 245, you might get by with only 2 sets and yea they will be cheaper cause they are smaller. Now one new set of hoosiers at 412.00 each for 335's comes to 1648.00 plus tax and then you get a couple sets of used hoosiers from Lee for 300-400 dollars and one set of decent street tires for daily driving and for rain tires and your cost is around 3500.00, wow a 3 thousand dollar saving with hoosiers.

Well, my thoughts on that.

One - I think Paul's original tires wore better than you may be giving them credit for. I'm not sure but I don't think he bought another set for a year.

Two - if the brakes will allow it, he can go down an inch on all four corners in Street to try to get better sizes. He could at least go down to 18's all the way around and ditch the 19s in the rear which should get into some better tire selection.

Three - A C7 is well above the cost of the average car in Street Category. Probably the most expensive car in Street other than a GT3/Viper. No offense to Paul intended, but if you're banging around in a C7, I don't sympathize with your tire costs.

Four - If you're really trying to compete nationally, you're not going to show up to an event on used tires. They're fine for locals, sure.

Five - Hoosiers on a Vette? You have to get em to the event. This means a tow rig or a tire trailer, plus trying to find a hitch that looks good on a Vette. Realistically, yeah, you could probably figure this out somehow for one of the closer events like the Bowling Green event or Dixie, but if you're going to THE Nationals, things get logistically tougher.

Six (My final thought) - Long live SSR. Because I really do believe that those cars should stay in Hoosiers. At least until participation declines drastically or a new car comes in that upsets everything.

[steverife]

Also the used race tire market is really size dependent. Everything I ever bought used for my Mazda was absolute junk and more expensive per run than a new tire.

[jcox07]

Steve you have been shopping in the wrong place and chris I will have my street tires at the test n tune and let you drive the mustang on them and you will FINALLY understand that street tires on some cars don't belong and I have said it many times before, the street tire movement is just a fad. Nascar catered to the young crowd and can't even half way fill bristol any more and mark it down the street tire movement in scca autox will start a downward fall in the next 2-3 years. Just like the 200 tw rating has already run some top sts drivers out of that class. I am not saying that people shouldn't be able to race on street tires, but Chris wait till you start going to nationals this year and pay attention to the street cars that come in with tire trailers in tow with 2-3 sets of wheels and tires.

[steverife]

You can use a popular size. The only people that would run my tire size were the Showroom Stock guys and they would absolutely abuse those tires.

[thrdeye]

Steve you have been shopping in the wrong place and chris I will have my street tires at the test n tune and let you drive the mustang on them and you will FINALLY understand that street tires on some cars don't belong and I have said it many times before, the street tire movement is just a fad. Nascar catered to the young crowd and can't even half way fill bristol any more and mark it down the street tire movement in scca autox will start a downward fall in the next 2-3 years. Just like the 200 tw rating has already run some top sts drivers out of that class. I am not saying that people shouldn't be able to race on street tires, but Chris wait till you start going to nationals this year and pay attention to the street cars that come in with tire trailers in tow with 2-3 sets of wheels and tires.

Umm Yeah, did you see thought #6? I completely agree that some cars deserve the Hoosier and I've driven RWD cars on shitty tires enough times to know the difference. No argument about that.

On the other hand, your other comment about "the downward fall of autox" I completely disagree with. And category attendance numbers at nationals seem to indicate that you'd be incorrect about that too.

Also, if I can afford to get a tow rig anytime soon I'm going to start towing. There are advantages to that regardless of the tire you're running. Especially if you drive a 1.3 gas guzzler that could blow up at any minute and have two dogs.

[jcox07]

The downward fall won't start for 2-3 years as it is still new to the new age crowd that the scca has trended toward, but it will be just like nascar which for years you could not hardly get a bristol ticket at all and now they can't even half way fill it due to the catering to the new crowd. Same thing will happen with the street tire movement.

[dewittpayne]

Jeff,

Not to hijack the thread, but.. You'll have to be more specific about exactly what NASCAR did to 'cater to the new crowd'. I'm of the opinion that it was a function of the economy and the Car of Tomorrow. A local restaurant owner said his business had started going down on race week before attendance started dropping. The motor home crowd stopped going out to eat. Then they stopped coming. The COT, which was motivated by NASCAR greed, made it crystal clear to everyone that there was, in fact, zero actual between the brands other than insignificant differences in body shapes and decals. Even TV ratings are down.

[Gen52SS]

Jeff,

Not to hijack the thread, but.. You'll have to be more specific about exactly what NASCAR did to 'cater to the new crowd'. I'm of the opinion that it was a function of the economy and the Car of Tomorrow. .

That's how I saw it as well...DeWitt

[jcox07]

If you had any nascar papers or mags subscriptions from years ago mainly 2002-2007 when the cot was introduced, that is when the writing wanting more door to door racing and no hard core bumping and all the drivers need to have a chance to win letters were being written. Nascar came with the car of tomorrow and changed a lot of rules and there is no way that every car on track will have the same chance to win, you have the top tier teams and the field fillers and that is the way it has always been, then nascar changed a lot and it has cost them the core race fans that built the sport to sold out tracks at almost every event.I am for the best racing you can get, but making those changes did not work and the street tire movement will work for 2-4 years and then the new autoxers will get bored and go to something else, that is my belief. I had a father that was in a pit crew till the early 70's. I was a huge nascar fan and Bill Elliott fan and have been to every track in the south and have seen first hand how nascar has tried to make more people get into nascar and it worked for a couple years, but they didn't stay with the sport and nothing they can do now will get the tracks sold out like they used to be. The cot was not ever going to happen with the status quo fans and teams that raced except that nascar wanted to build bigger race facilties to hold more seats and sell to a new market crowd. It worked for a couple years as I still have season tickets to both races at Lowes motor speedway, but have not been in many years and it is getting harder and harder to sell them.

[jcox07]

Nascar was a redneck southern sport and selling out tracks and when they went after a new market area like Kansas City track, Kentucky speedway, which had to sue nascar to get a event after nascar ticket sales to that event didn't even get to 20 % and Las Vegas and Fontana all new to nascar and never close to a sell out, the core fans that did travel to more than just one or two tracks then quit going to a lot of races, every year at charlotte the people with season tickets around mine have sold theirs as well or had to eat them cause they are not going any more either.

[flier129]

I think I'll go through 3-4 sets of Hoosiers this year at the same price of one set of street tires. Hoosiers for the track, kooks for autox. Used Hoosiers in miata sizes are easy to find dirt cheap

[Gen52SS]

Nascar came with the car of tomorrow and changed a lot of rules and there is no way that every car on track will have the same chance to win, you have the top tier teams and the field fillers and that is the way it has always been. I am for the best racing you can get, but making those changes did not work and the street tire movement will work for 2-4 years and then the new autoxers will get bored and go to something else, that is my belief.

Agree...with some of the things you said along with a BAD economy good points on this. However I would like to try to get this thread back on track. There is a thread for TIRES. I had hoped for some posts here like......the one I'm making..... a prediction "I will win my class this season" .....not only that but my average finish in PAX last season was 48th....SUCKS ....I will be in the top 20 in 2015. My last prediction is I'll beat most street category cars running 200TW tires ...some by RAW times others in PAX. Now who's man or lady enough to except? ....all in fun right?