FastTrack.. and tires. LOL!

[steverife]

If they go up in price, people will either keep buying them or quit autocrossing (as much or as seriously). If the numbers drop, rule changes will be considered.

All of that is irrespective to what treadwear we are allowed to run.

The average national competitor is going to be fine with copying the fast guys. Worst case, you are an event or two behind the curve. The Hankook proved to be good enough to win over the RE71R at Dixie. I've been around street tire classes for a decade now, the only time people were really left out in the cold was with the Bridgestone RE01R's against the Falkens in 2007...and that only lasted a month or so.

[thrdeye]

Well, in street category (and ST to some degree), it is pretty simple. Run what the fastest people have tested and make your car work with it.

In street category, there are very limited adjustments that can be made to the car, so most of the tire testing will be conditions-based (wet, hot, concrete, asphalt) and I have a second set of wheels for something else if necessary. JB can adjust his setup for soft sidewall, stiff sidewall, etc. since he can change spring rate and a gaggle of other stuff.

Jason Stroud and I ran almost an identical time on day two at Dixie. He's on a 255/35 Bridgestone, I'm on 245/40 Hankook. The delta between really fast and mid pack is much narrower with street tires. Almost to the point it's within driver noise.

So, some people shave tires. Good gains on the TOYO, but very diminishing returns on a tire with a typical big block tread pattern like Kook, BFG, Falken, Bridgestone. Additionally, if a driver can tell the difference between shaved and not on those 4 big block tires, then they are probably alien status anyway.

Also, if we are considering money, then JB is doing pretty good dealing his leftover crack to these STM people to get some of that back.

Yes, it's true. You can buy one set of Hoosiers cheaper than you can buy 3 sets of whatever street tire. But a decent driver is still going to be able to come out and run for the trophies without any testing, shaving, etc. And your one set of Hoosiers isn't going to get you in the trophies if everyone else shows up with freshies.

Look at it this way...there's no difference in testing a bunch of street tires than there is someone running Hoosiers and trying to get a lot of seat time. If you want to win, you'll get as much seat time as you can. 12 regionals, a school, 5 national events (that's about 200 runs with a codriver)....get real, that's at least 3 sets of Hoos if you are trying to be up front at all....and even at three sets, you may not be on your best tires for some national events. Figure you'll need more Hoos for cars that are really hard on them.

Anyway, that's my thought process. With streets, I can afford to get a ton more seat time and not worry about managing the tires, in turn improving my driving and getting me toward the front.

The "R guys" keep coming up with a lot of "what ifs". And yes, these are things to keep in mind but nothing has happened yet. The SEB needs to make sure they keep their ideals in line from when this change was made and I think the current crew will do that. Hopefully it carries on. I don't see how it can't as long as the numbers continue to rise as they have been.

[steverife]

People also seem to discard the testing done by the R-comp folks. I ran 4 different front tires my last full year on R-comps. People have tested A6's against A7's. People tested A6's against the BFG's and the Goodyears. The V710 was the top tire for a while. People absolutely tested those. Just because you've been able to get by without testing yourself for a few years doesn't mean that testing doesn't happen in DOT classes.

[scottgib]

The key difference is most autocrossers are going to let those who are determined to do very well nationally do the testing. True we will be a little late getting the right tire for our car, but that leaves a lot of money to do something else. Sure I want to get as close to JB's times as I can, but I won't spend much money to do it. I think that I am not the only one with that attitude. With this (loser JB may say) approach street tires are cheaper. But I still have fun.

[jcox07]

I'm not saying the testing of r comps doesn't happen but all I have heard is the new street tire movement is the saving grace for auto crossing and it is the greatest thing since peanut butter, but if u truly want to win year you can copy what others do but the rivals worked on the Hondas last year but not the miatas but the top drivers will always test to see which tire works best I have seen it with my own eyes last year as street tire class drivers were showing up with 3 to 4 sets of tires and that ain't no fluke that they did that, it was cause one tire would be better than the other on certain surfaces, you can say want you want Steve but for the top tier drivers it has drove up the cost for those classes. Yes John has gotten back a little money on the tires he sells but it ain't a lot.

[TedV]

I can see the benefit of a natural progression of the classes from street, street touring, street prepared, street mod, prepared, modified. It always struck me strange to go from R comps in stock to 140TW in ST. So fine, I can see all the slower street classes going to 200 TW except the fastest where the cars came from the factory with less than 200 TW. Fine, they get to keep their R-comps . Again, too many classes for me to keep up with all the rules, my bad.

I shake my head at the "ban toyo" when the new tire isn't even out yet. Its the same thing with "Ban Loosiers and Kum Ho's". SCCA isn't the only place the tires get blamed. Legend cars run the Federal tires as spec. Read this article http://legendsnation.com/2015/03/21/in- ... cut-tires/ sounds like they are blaming the street tires to me.

The original Rival had a 200TW. the new S for SOFT has a 200 TW... hmmmm.. are the letters flying to ban that one?

My comment, Its the Same Stuff, Different Day. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKhEw7nD9C4

[jcox07]

Chris, take a look at the a-6's on my car tomorrow, they were nationals tires brand new then and come tell me how many runs you think are on those tires I bet you are not even close.

[thrdeye]

Sure. You can make the suspension work the tire properly in ESP.

....and surely if you're getting 120 runs per set, then you're only running one set per year, right?

Quantity of runs doesn't equal quality runs. A street tire will cycle out, as well. But according to folks that have run the hankooks over the last year....it takes a long time (130+ runs)

[jcox07]

No it takes two sets and a good set from Lee which is very cheap but still take in mind winning two Hoosiers is 850.00 dollars worth of tires and Mazda money and bridge stone money is 500.00 if you win but ask John if he could win on just any tire. Tom O'Gorman and others like him can jump in a car with any tire and make it look good but will still finish close to the top but we ain't in that league.

[thewelder]

I would like to see one of the STS guys try the federal tires that the legend cars run. They may be a ringer.

[MARKP]

Federals are below 200tw.

We put a lot of runs on Hoosiers on an HS Subaru. Doesn't get much worse on suspension than that.

[oldmuscle69]

Really still going there!!

[jcox07]

Going where Bob? If you are talking about 200 TW in Sts then go back and look at my post. STS requires 200 tw no less. If a car runs less than 200, they will get no points till the car has 200 or higher on it.

[thewelder]

I thought they were 300tw. That was the old BFG's.

[oldmuscle69]

Sorry for those that did not know, I'm going nowhere but I am having fun with this. Sorta like reading between the lines.